Lawrence Ray is the Non-Technical Product Team Lead at Bitrefill, where he plays a crucial role in enhancing user experiences related to bitcoin and the Lightning Network.
With a background in entrepreneurship, insurance, project management, and business development, Lawrence has cultivated a deep understanding of how to make bitcoin accessible and practical for everyday users.
In this interview, he shares his insights on the challenges and innovations within the Lightning ecosystem, as well as his vision for the future of money. 
Table of Contents
Initial Steps into Bitcoin and Lightning
- What initially drew you to the world of bitcoin and the Lightning Network?
I was learning about ‘crypto’ more and more and a friend of mine paid me back for dinner via the Lightning Network and set me up on Blue Wallet at the time. It’s how I discovered Bitrefill, where I now work.
For me, using bitcoin on the Bitrefill widget in Blue Wallet’s mobile app was like a Eureka moment – seeing ‘crypto’ being usable for buying something in the real world (In this case Spyro on Nintendo Switch) so fast and with such low fees really got me thinking about what is possible and Lightning helped me see bitcoin as something more than an investment tool only.
- What advice would you give to newcomers looking to contribute to the Lightning ecosystem?
If you are technically minded – reach out to those who have built tools or led projects you appreciate and try to extract some knowledge from them where you can.
If, like me; your skills aren’t with development, then you are still very important. Consider what you are building or could build in the fields you are knowledgeable in which could integrate the LN in some way.
Even if it is just accepting payments via a third party who takes care of the hard parts for you. It still adds to the overall ecosystem and helps to create a circular economy.
Overcoming Challenges in the Space
- What was the most challenging aspect of getting started in this space?
I think for me it was understanding the pitfalls and stress of trading altcoins. I really just had to go through those early experiences and learn the hard lessons myself.
I finally realized it was better for me to focus on any building or philosophising; creating something which was a genuinely ‘good’ or ‘profitable’ idea on its own and then just utilising the most sensible currency or currencies available.
I can understand why bitcoiners can be so stand-offish and ‘toxic’ because it gets tiring saying the same thing over and over again to someone new, but to be honest the ‘toxicity’ of bitcoin sadly only pushed me away from the space for quite some time initially.
- What are some common misconceptions about the Lightning Network that you encounter?
I’ve fallen victim over my time to having misconceptions and I’m sure it will happen again in the future. I’d say one of the largest would be not truly understanding the amount of work which goes into successfully managing a node and the various channels which will be opened and closed with others.
Building on the Lightning Network
- Can you walk us through a recent project you’ve completed on the Lightning Network?
Adding the Lightning Network deposit feature to the EU Bitrefill Card. Most of the work was done by Alejandro who is our resident Lightning expert and an all-round great guy.
Our card partner does much of the heavy lifting here, so it wasn’t the toughest experience, but our learnings from how we have presented Lightning to users who want to deposit to the card compared to the other ‘crypto’ options has helped us in our coming redesign to the deposit feature for all currencies.
- What are the most exciting use cases for the Lightning Network that you’ve seen or worked on?
For now the EU Bitrefill Card and ppq.ai really does seem like the most exciting to me. This is likely because my main interests are in services which can be used by someone who doesn’t need to understand much about how bitcoin or the Lightning Network works and for whom it can solve a legitimate problem or make a big impact in their daily life.
I don’t think realistically in the future many people should actually need to understand how bitcoin or Lightning works. They should not have to care.
Community Engagement and Influences
- Who or what has been your biggest influence in the bitcoin community?
Easily Andreas Antonopoulos. I couldn’t care less what peoples’ opinions are about him after he wrote about Ethereum. His early talks and his ‘Mastering Bitcoin‘ and ‘Mastering Lightning‘ books are so fantastic and full of so many golden nuggets of information.
He makes concepts and information which can seem intimidating and complex at first really quite simple. His early work talking and writing about bitcoin means more than what most of your favourite bitcoin influencers have to say.
- How important is community feedback in shaping your projects?
It is the most important. My biggest challenge is trying to find new ways to obtain honest feedback from current or potential users.
What does the Future hold?
- In one sentence, how would you summarize your vision for the future of money with respect to bitcoin and Lightning?
Struggling but hopefully succeeding to avoid becoming a tool dominated by governments and banks.
- Where do you see Lightning in 10 years from now?
If I’m honest, it feels as if Lightning is becoming a service which is going to consist of 99%+ of users using custodial services. This to me is quite sad, as when I found out about it in 2019 and started using it, it felt magical and I was excited to see if I could use it non-custodially like BTC on chain, but the likely reality really in my eyes is that it won’t be practical or worth it for the majority of users to do so.
- If you could have dinner with any figure in the bitcoin space, who would it be and why?
Andreas Antonopoulos. He is probably the person I have learnt the most from about bitcoin.
- Finally, what’s next for you personally, and how can we support your journey moving forward?
I am loving the challenge I’m facing right now at Bitrefill of working on the EU Bitrefill Card and eSIMs most of the time, as well as understanding more and more of the technical side of what we do. (I come from an entrepreneurial, insurance, project management and business development background).
However, I am really interested in spending a few hours a week of my spare time mostly on weekends helping out with other projects that are small teams of motivated people trying to build a solution that solves real world problems.
So if anyone is working on something cool and thinks I could lend them a hand or connect them with someone who can, then please do reach out. I’m on the Orange Pill App and also Telegram @lawrence_ray.
